Tony Montana VS Tommy Vercetti (Scarface vs Grand Theft Auto) VS Prediction Blog
(Advent_Chao)
(JJ:DK)
(Studio 8558)
"There's no such thing as good money or bad money. There's just money." - Lucky Luciano
Tony Montana, the Scarface & cocaine king of Miami.
Tommy Vercetti, the Hardwood Butcher & crimelord of Vice City.
Oh, Florida. Home of palm trees, bright sun, and an overwhelming sense of drug violence. These two entered this state with nothing, but quickly built themself up as masters of criminal work. They will off anyone who gets in the way of their drug trade, even their own best friends, making the state-or rather, their world theirs. However, we all know 2 drug kingpins can’t peacefully coexist, and it’s time to see who’s the superior street master in this side of the Sunshine State! Would the Scarface waste Tommy, or would the Hardwood Butcher push him to his final limit? Guns are active, let’s lock and load.
Hello! This is Toppat Torchwick on the FIRST project I’ll be mostly taking over in this blog stuff. Hopefully, this won’t be too noticeable with my writing style. This has been a blog I figured should be relatively simple and fun for my first blog. I'm taking over for the time being, and I just really enjoy both series, so I'm hoping this will make this match more popular in the VS Community.
For Tony Montana, this’s gonna be relatively simple. We will be using the original movie from 1983, as well as the game “Scarface: The World Is Yours.” While it’s sort of an alternative ending to the original film, it doesn’t change anything else in the original film, and acts as a sequel to the movie if Tony survived. It also keeps the tone of the original movie as well, with no retcons, so we believe it should be good to use (and also frankly makes Tony way more interesting in VS). We will also be going through the IDW comics for Tony, for supporting evidence, as well as the computer games and novelization.
For Tommy Vercetti, this will focus on the 3D Era of Grand Theft Auto. Obviously, this includes the 2 Vice City games- Grand Theft Auto Vice City & Vice City Stories, but also Grand Theft Auto III, Advance, Liberty City Stories, and San Andreas. The series from IV onwards is not gonna be included in this blog due to it explicitly taking place in a different continuity, and the 2 eras never intersecting with each other.
Background
Tony Montana
“Me? I want what’s coming to me: The World, Chico. And everything in it.”
Ambition. Power. Everything to make the world his no matter what. Perfect submissions on the story of Miami’s most infamous crime lord, Tony Montana. Tony’s story started in the 1950s, one of the many kids living in the slums of Havana, Cuba, during Fidel Castro’s Revolution and rise to power, hearing from his grandfather the stories from his old days as a doorman at the Cristobal Beach Hotel.
The kid grew enamoured of the lifestyle his grandfather described, the playboys, the chorus girls, the Bentleys, and the diamond chokers. No matter how hard his mother tried to straighten him into the right hard and rocky path, Tony knew what he wanted in his life: The World and Everything in it. At age 14, and now alone after his mother and sister left for the promise of the American Dream, he joined his first gang, “The Devil’s Cousins”, and began his long, long criminal career. Tony hustled his way into a variety of different businesses, drug smuggling, scams, theft, but no matter what, all roads led to the Cuban army that he had grown to despise after a life of misfortune and poverty. While he was a terrific fighter, he would never remain a soldier. For him flags, countries, none of it mattered, all he wanted was to find a chance to finally step into the land where all his dreams of grandeur and wealth could come true.
And so, one day, one way or another he finally found his golden ticket: Fidel Castro had allowed a mass emigration of Cubans to the promised United States in what would be known as the Mariel boatlift. And after taking out one of his former allies for green cards, Tony, alongside long time friends Manny Rivera, Angel and Chi-Chi, was finally taking his first steps to live the American dream under the scorching heat of Miami, Florida. But things didn’t pan out as expected, the only work Tony and Manny could find were as dishwashers for a restaurant.
Montana was hungry for the day where he could properly get into some business, and he didn’t need to wait long as he got in contact with Omar Suarez, one of the right hand men of druglord Frank Lopez, for an exchange of yeyo, altho his attitude wasn’t to the liking of his employer, and Tony found the deal go awry as he was captured and tortured. Against all odds, Tony survived, and knew that he had been double crossed, but he kept his tongue tied for the moment, waiting for the perfect time to retaliate. In the meantime, he was content with trying to slowly form a bond with Frank’s wife Elvira and to reconnect with his family, however only his sister Gina really responded to it, as his mother was very ashamed of what his son had become.
Then, things began falling into place, Tony and Omar were sent by Frank to oversee negotiations for a large amount of cocaine with one of the big fishes of the Ecuador drug trade: Alejandro Sosa. Sosa saw potential in Tony, seeing him as a man of conviction, brains and balls. After eliminating Omar revealing him as a police informant, he negotiated with Tony behind Frank’s back for a large amount of money, which only pissed Lopez off. He tried having Tony killed not short after but once again, Montana cheated death, and now he was done fucking around, having found the foothold he needed, he and Manny executed Frank and took over his business as Sosa’s distributor all over Miami.
For a time, life was great, Tony found himself the biggest kingpin in Miami’s criminal history. He and Elvira got married, he got Gina her very own barber shop, and the money kept piling up via several different companies he founded to wash his earnings. He had finally lived up to the mantra he had kept close to his heart: The World Was His, And Everything In It.
However, that very same confidence started becoming his downfall: His relationship with Elvira began rapidly falling apart as it ultimately ended with her leaving, he and Manny talked less and less and were far more openly aggressive towards each other, he became overprotective over Gina, he started penny pinching against the bankers that washed his money and started looking for alternative ways to wash his money, which only ended with him arrested for money laundering and tax fraud in a sting operation. And to make matters worse, to ease his worries about his crumbling empire, he made the mistake that no self respecting drug lord should make: He got hooked on his own stuff.
It wasn’t looking good, Tony was facing 5 years and the risk of losing it all, but Sosa gave him an out: Help one of his assassins kill a journalist that was looking into his empire, and he’d move his influences to have all the charges dropped. The plan was going without a hitch, until Tony saw that the reporter wasn’t alone, accompanied by his wife and kids. Tony, in a rare sign of compassion, refused to have the children die, and murdered the assassin before he could explode a car bomb. And with the journalist’s story hitting the masses, Sosa swore revenge against Tony’s betrayal.
Tony, close to his breaking point and in a cocaine fueled stupor, found out by his mother that Gina was seeing someone in Coconut Grove, and that his influence had completely corrupted her kind soul into someone just like him. Leaving his mother to curse him like the devil he was, Tony quickly headed to the Grove to confront whoever was seeing her, and to his surprise, that someone was Manny. Montana didn’t even notice when his friend laid dead on the floor, bleeding from the gunshots he himself had given him, with his sister sobbing next to his corpse.
Yet the night wasn’t over yet, Sosa’s men besieged his mansion, Gina tried to kill him for ruining her life and died to one of Sosa’s men, and wherever he looked, Tony was quickly running out of allies and resources. By the end, he was left by himself to fend off against the dozens of men knocking on his doorstep to defend the ruins of what had been his life’s work.
But it was in vain, while he yelled at his would-be killers that they could never take him down, that he was the best of the best… one of them sneaked behind him with a shotgun, and finally put him down for good. His corpse laying in the fountain that marked his life’s motto: The World is Yours.
… Well, that was how the movie ended anyways. But side material like the comic Scarred for Life and the game The World is Yours have scenarios where Tony manages to fend off death just long enough for him to get back to his feet. He is angry, his empire is gone and he is back to square one, nevertheless, he got himself right back up and unleashed the fury that had always been a part of him for so long. Bodies dropped, numbers rose, and with his power restored and him ready, he took the fight right back to Sosa and blew his brains all over the floor.
He did it, the World was His once again.
But we all know that won’t last.
Look, we’ll be real with you. Tony will never learn. He is incapable of learning. He was dead set on his path the moment those dreams of lights and gold were put into his brain and from then on there was no force in this world that would ever get him to stop, him or his ego. Because Tony thrives in the fight, in the struggle to make it to the top, but it’s a fool’s errand, every time he gets there something it’s bound to break apart by his own making, and everyone who allies with him will end up a victim of its falling debris.
That’s the tragedy of Tony Montana’s story. Forever doomed to chase a high he will never keep, and no matter the situation or the timeline, to rot by his own self-destructive tendencies and greed.
The World is Yours, but only for so long.
Tommy Vercetti
When you joined the Forelli’s Crime Family, you wouldn’t expect what’s simply a goon to gain absolute power in Vice City, but that would be the case with Tommy Vercetti. Little was known about his past as a boy, other than the fact that he once helped his father clean the rollers at his printing job in Liberty City, a life Tommy planned to follow himself. But as he put it, he “lived a different life”, joining the mafia at age 15 as he rose through the ranks throughout the following five years.
But Tommy’s luck would take a turn for the worse as one of his jobs went very wrong. Being tasked to take out one man, Vercetti found himself ambushed by eleven assassins, managing to kill them just before the police swarmed the place and arrested him. The site was so horrendous that his nickname from now on became “The Hardwood Butcher”, and not even the 15 years in prison he took for the Forelli family managed to make people forget about the carnage seen that day.
Sonny Forelli, then Don of said mob, knew this and had a plan: Use Tommy as his ticket to take over the rapidly increasing drug trade in Vice City before any of his rivals could. The deal was simple: a trade of Grade-A Colombian cocaine at the port, in and out. Or it could have been, had the deal not been interrupted by a firing squad that Tommy just barely managed to escape with his life.
Now with no money, no coke, a very angry Sonny breathing down his neck, and a burning desire for revenge, Tommy set out to find the one that fucked him over and kick him to the curb. Allied with anxiety-ridden lawyer Ken Rosenberg, right-hand man and ex-co leader of his own gang, Lance Vance, and a variety of the worst the city of Vice had to offer, Tommy found himself face to face against the man who targeted the deal, Ricardo Diaz, as he and Lance stormed his mansion and left him agonizing before dealing the final blow.
From then on, Tommy saw a golden opportunity. The money and the stuff didn’t matter anymore; this was going to become his operation, his own criminal gang that would rise to the top of Vice City’s underworld, and nothing was going to stand in his way. Tommy set off to acquire a variety of assets all over the city as his influence, connections, and sources of income grew; he became almost unstoppable. But problems would start arising at the surface as Sonny realized he’d been had, trying to steal from one of Tommy’s operations as a way of taking back from the debt that had put them there in the first place. When that failed, Sonny set his sights on more subtle ways to take out his now traitorous upstart.
Sonny showed up alongside his men to take what was owed to him, which Tommy handed to him without much fuss… on the surface, in reality, Forelli had already known that the cash Vercetti so generously gave to him was fake. He had managed to ally himself with Lance, who had long felt that Tommy hadn’t given him the credit and appreciation he deserved, to seemingly ruin his plans.
However, the cash was merely a formality, Tommy never really planned to back down. He just wanted to piss him off before he killed him. And as his old nickname once symbolized, he butchered everyone who stormed his mansion: The Forelli goons looking to make an example out of him, the traitorous ally that had sold him out, and even Sonny Forelli himself, avenging all the time he had wasted by working under him to begin with.
By the end of the carnage, it was only he and Rosenberg staring over the horizon, as Tommy wasn’t going to get any heat from up north anymore; it was all down south now. He had become the king of Vice City. And by the looks of it, Tommy hasn’t dulled one bit, as even sixteen years later in 2002, he remains enough of a respected and feared figure of power in Vice City for Kent Paul to still fear even mentioning him.
From a cheap assassin to the head of a whole city’s criminal sphere, Tommy remains one of the most iconic characters in all of Grand Theft Auto.
Experience & Skill
Tony Montana
Even before Tony established himself as THE player in Miami’s drug trade, he was still pretty impressive. At age 14, he had joined his first gang, and the hustle never stopped from there, be it selling reefer all over town or smuggling guns and alcohol in his own whorehouse, Tony always had a keen eye for business. In the novelization, he even spent some time in France as he robbed a church with charity fraud and made himself look like a priest to rob the lonely wives of those more fortunate than him.
But Tony’s experience doesn’t just boil down to street smarts; he also served in the Cuban Military, having military training that only made him even more of a beast as he took down twelve men who had ambushed him and his team. Hell, in the IDW continuity, he even killed his teammates after refusing to let his friend Manny die. His hand-to-hand skills proved how crafty he is as he cut off a man’s arm with a knife and sliced another man’s neck with a razor in his teeth. His guerrilla tactics were also pretty good to the point that he could successfully sneak around an armed coast and escape in a rowboat without issue. His skills with a gun are second to none, as he can manage his way around a large variety of weapons without much issue.
And all of this is before he set foot in the States, slowly building an empire out of nothing and always looking for new business opportunities wherever he can find them, building a pretty effective network that helped him get such a stronghold on the Miami crime scene– Twice!
There is a catch to all of this, however, and it’s that Tony does his best with a specific goal to strive for. His time at the top, while pretty impressive, eventually suffered under the pressure of its own weight, and without the drive for more, Tony began picking fights where he shouldn’t have, which eventually led to his empire crumbling the first time. And despite him getting it back, there is no guarantee that he won’t make similar mistakes in the future.
Tommy Vercetti
Even before the events of the game, Tommy had spent a lot of time working under the Forelli family mafia, rising through the ranks from ages 15 to 20, which on its own is pretty impressive considering Liberty City’s own long, bloody history around the main three families. He even survived an ambush by eleven assassins on his own, which earned him the name of the Hardwood Butcher.
And it seems 15 years behind bars didn’t dull his senses one bit. Not only did he now hold his own against much larger groups of people, but he also did so again on his own. But he also won several races around Vice City, drove around drones in delicate operations, and has shown himself to be adept at a pretty large variety of weapons and vehicles that he never really struggles with. Tommy has shown time and time again to be the right man for any job the city of Vice throws against him, from smaller gangs, fighting SWAT forces in a bank robbery, to even fighting against the French Secret Service on repeated occasions. His skills are so good that he can easily take jobs impersonating a skilled assassin named Leo Teal and have nobody suspect anything.
Tommy has also built a network of different businesses to launder his money through, varying from real estate, his own ice cream company, porn movie studio, car dealership, cab business, and the crown jewel of his whole operation: The Malibu Club.
Equipment
Tony Montana
Weapons
(“SAY HELLO TO MY LITTLE FRIEND!”)
If you wanna make it big as a crime lord in any city, especially the sun-tanned Florida from the 1980s, you need to pack a few heaters ready to kill anyone who dares to interfere with your twisted dreams. Tony has packed quite a few weapons throughout his journey to absolute power, such as the following:
Vehicles
(“What you talking about? That's a Cadillac!”)
There is nothing like showing off the money and the power with some sweet, sweet, rides. Initially Tony only really showed a handful of vehicles in his original movie, but The World is Yours greatly expands his car catalogue and then some with vehicles worth Pushing to the Limit for.
Rise of Tony Montana Power-Ups
In the mobile Java game, The Rise of Tony Montana, Tony has access to a variety of different power-ups to pick up. A lot of these are things he should already have that we’ve shown before, but a few are unique enough to add.
Tommy Vercetti
Weapons
(“TOMMY VERCETTI, REMEMBER THE NAME!”)
Surviving the day-to-day in Vice City’s criminal life is impossible without something on you to keep you safe from all who try to waste you, and by god, does Tommy have some firepower stuffed in those cheap pants of his. How does he keep everything in his literal back pocket? Secrets of the trade, I suppose.
Vehicles
(“Mm, nice bike.”)
Hey, it wouldn't be a Grand Theft Auto game without some Autos to Theft. And Tommy’s no stranger to vehicular manslaughter, now in beautiful 1980s flavor! Along with some extra spicy vehicles for those special times when you need something extra for the job (or if you get bored and fiddle around with some cheat codes).
With 100% completion, all these vehicles gain double durability.
Health Pickups
If Tommy’s taken one too many shots, he can get back on his feet with these useful health pickups that will instantly bring him back to fighting shape.
Body Armor
It’s nice to have protection. This set of Body Armor not only protects Tommy against bullets, it basically acts like a second health bar that he can use to survive all kinds of damage that could kill him otherwise, from being ran over by a car to withstanding several explosions to his face. Beating the game to a 100% completion will double its durability, making it even more effective.
Abilities
Tony Montana
Sheer Endurance
Despite being a normal guy for the most part, Tony can take a LOT of punishment and keep going. He’s been stabbed, shot dozens of times, tortured, and survived. Even after getting shot several times at the end of his escape in The World Is Yours, he kept going and still managed to drive off. This is likely due to the adrenaline and cocaine he’s fueled by, but make no mistake. This is a tough son of a bitch to put down.
Tommy Vercetti
Fall Damage Immunity
Tommy is unique among his peers in the GTA protagonist podium in that fall damage is downright negligible to him. No matter if it’s accidentally falling off the stairs or at the max altitude the game can offer, Tommy will just roll the pain out and go about his day.
You may think it’s weird that we are classifying this under abilities, but given the uniqueness of Tommy’s situation compared to other games, we thought it was worth bringing up.
Infinite Sprinting
While normally Tommy would tire after sprinting for a few seconds, completing all 12 Paramedic Missions removes this limitation entirely, giving him free rein to run as much as he wants without ever stopping.
Unlimited Ammo
A 100% completion bonus that Tommy can have is access to unlimited ammo for any weapon he wields; hell, he even GAINS ammo with every single shot fired.
Fire Immunity
After completing all Firefighter missions, Tommy becomes completely impervious to fire damage.
Forms
Tony Montana
Rage Mode
Tony’s always been known for a short temper, but in The World is Yours, he’s capable of using it to his benefit. Boosting Tony’s speed and making his weapons auto-lock onto targets. Whichever weapon Tony activates Rage Mode with will have unlimited ammo and no need to reload for as long as the mode is active. While also letting Tony get health by killing enemies. But most importantly, it makes Tony completely invulnerable to all damage sources in-game. Tony’s rage lets him walk through any bullets, explosions, blades, or physical blows that come his way. The only major drawback being the mode only lasts for roughly 10 seconds
Tommy Vercetti
Under Adrenaline Pills
When Tommy’s feeling a bit under the weather, and by under the weather we mean being shot to death, he does what anyone else would do and takes some medication to feel a little bit better. This life-saving med is an Adrenaline Pill that greatly boosts his strength, making him able to send people flying through the air with a single punch or kick, and greatly slows down his perception of time as if he is seeing things in slow motion.
The effects last pretty long, too, lasting for around a minute of real time and 20 minutes of in-game time. And at the very least, he should have access to one of these pills at all times, given that there is an always available pill in his mansion.
Feats
Tony Montana
Overall
Became the drug lord of Miami.
Served in the Cuban Military and was one of the few convicts to survive on the Border of Namibia, killing twelve men in a sneak attack.
Escaped service either via sneaking out in a rowboat or straight up killing his squadmates.
Alongside Manny, Angel, and Chi Chi, they made their own operation in Havana, Cuba, smuggling guns and booze in their own whorehouse.
Spent years in France robbing rich wives by pretending to be a priest, before getting caught trying to steal candy.
Killed Frank Lopez, George Sheffield, Gaspar Gomez, Alfonso & Edgar Diaz, and Alejandro Sosa.
Set up the Montana Realty Company and Montana Diamond Trading Company as fronts for laundering.
Even after losing all his power and assets, he started back from the beginning and took it all back in two separate continuities.
Had THE most iconic one-liner in crime movie history.
Overall, a bonafide son of a bitch.
Power
Strangled Boots Eddie with a colostomy bag despite being beaten and only recently getting out of a coma. Which had caused him to become temporarily wheelchair bound do to muscle atrophy
Bloodied Agent Tooms’ nose and then restrained him with his own chains
Speed
Durability
Somehow survived the shooting from the end of the movie, not bleeding out after 9 bullets to the chest and 3 to the upper appendages. Although important to note that he was put into a coma and needed intensive surgery after the fact.
Can get back up even after a beating from multiple police officers
Capable of getting right back up even after having speeding cars run into him
Tony is unaffected by being inside his vehicles while he takes insane jumps or nasty car crashes
Gets right back up after being knocked back by the shockwave of an RPG explosion
Tommy Vercetti
Overall
Became the crime lord of Vice City.
Even before arriving in Vice City, he was known as “The Hardwood Butcher” after killing eleven assassins sent to kill him.
Alongside Phil Cassidy and Cam Jones, successfully robbed the El Banco Corrupto Grande Bank in what was the first bank heist in the whole GTA series.
Fought against the French Secret Service multiple times to help his friend, Colonel Cortez.
Carried out multiple assassination jobs impersonating the hitman Leo Teal.
Owner of nine different assets across the whole city: Vercetti Estate, Cherry Popper Ice Cream Factory, the Pole Position club, InterGlobal Studios, Kaufman Cabs, the Boatyard, Sunshine Autos, Print Works, and the Malibu Club.
Saved Love Fist from a crazed stalker on two separate occasions. In one of them, having to drive a rigged vehicle at a certain speed so it does not explode.
Destroyed all of his rivals in the North.
Killed Ricardo Diaz, Lance Vance, and Sonny Forelli.
The only man in a Hawaiian shirt who has aura.
Has THE most iconic radio playlist in Grand Theft Auto history.
Seriously, though. Billy Jean, Kids in America, Owner of a Lonely Heart, Gold, Self Control, La Vida es Una Lenteja, Maracaibo Oriental, we could honestly go on all day.
Overall, a bonafide son of a bitch.
Power
As pictured above, he can make dents in cars with his bare hands.
With an Adrenaline Pill can send someone flying through the air with a single blow.
Speed
Managed to maneuver himself around a direct shootout that had everyone else in that area dead.
Can shoot precise targets while on top of moving helicopters and boats.
Durability
(Note: The “Cheat Activated” text appears because we used the BIGBANG cheat to explode all 4 cars at the same time)
With armor, he can survive up to 4 cars exploding in front of him. (0.012 Tons of TNT)
Stood pretty damn close to one of Phil Cassidy’s moonshine explosions and was perfectly fine.
Can survive falls from any height in the game (More on this in Abilities).
Scaling
Tony Montana
Yeah… Tony doesn’t really have much to scale from other characters in the Scarface franchise; all the best feats are his. I guess what he said is true: you fuck with him, you fuck with the best.
Tommy Vercetti
The Vance Brothers
Before Tommy, the Kings of Vice City were the ones named Victor and Lance Vance. Tommy was the one to put an end to Lance Vance’s Last Dance, and Lance should be pretty comparable to his brother as they both fought together in plenty of the same battles.
Vic and Lance survive a 11-30 story high fall... somehow completely fine and unharmed.
They should scale to Phil Cassidy, who got caught in an explosion. (0.0035 Tons of TNT)
Other GTA Protagonists
This may need some explaining, but there is definitely a scaling chain for this beyond the fact that all these characters are human, and it all ties to the Foreli Mafia. They are enemies throughout the 3D era of GTA, and each of the protagonists has to fend off against them, including Tommy. Each of the goons are able to fight against the protagonists, and Tommy’s able to dispatch them himself. All of these goons should definitely be equal to each other, as it’s not like they went to a training arc after Vice City (which takes place before games like III).
So, with that in mind, despite not meeting them, Tommy can definitely scale to the following:
Claude Speed
Managed to shove a gun off his head before it shot and punched out the one responsible.
Should compare to 8-Ball, who survived being pretty close to explosions on a cargo boat.
Toni Cipriani
Mike
Can also dodge tank rounds. (537.616 m/s) (Debatable, as Tank Shots move slower than bullets which is the opposite of what happens irl)
Carl “CJ” Johnson
Weaknesses
Tony Montana
If you look up “egotistical” in the dictionary, you’ll see Tony’s face right next to Napoleon's. The guy is VERY full of himself and constantly taunts to make himself feel better, often making enemies because of this. His drug addiction to his own product can also be a huge issue in disorienting him and making his ego problems more apparent.
Despite having impressive endurance, Tony’s still just a man and has died to bullets before. Any half-decent shot would still kill him.
Tommy Vercetti
As a fighter, Tommy’s generally well-balanced in the realm of gangsters, but his anger issues can cloud his judgment at times, making him take more aggressive routes when it’s not needed. He also can’t swim, which is a problem given that Vice City is full of water, so CLEARLY the best way to kill him is to push him in the ocean.
And much like his opponent, Tommy can’t take a bullet in a vital spot and will die to one. He may have armor, but it can break after enough damage, and it won’t protect against a headshot.
Before The Verdict…
Payday Scaling?
(Seriously, who TF is Hardcore Henry?)
Payday 2 has not just amassed itself as one of the best horde shooters ever and is something everyone should play (except if you’re on console), but they have amassed quite a few licensed characters to join their squad of nobodies with nothing to lose. Jacket, John Wick, Jimmy from Hardcore Henry, etc. Tony himself also appears in this game under the alias “The Scarface” for his temporary DLC. Now, the canonicity of Payday does not apply to everyone and has been debated for characters like Wick before, but it’s good to mention here. Does Tony get scaling from this game?
Unfortunately, no, there are a lot of in-lore reasons on both parties that make scaling to Payday unviable. The biggest one is, of course, Tony’s still dead in this timeline. This was highlighted in his FBI files, which mentioned it. The Events of The World Is Yours were not mentioned in this game as well; hell, the level of Scarface Mansion was taken over by someone not in Scarface itself. The Scarface in the game was confirmed to be someone impersonating Tony himself, not actually being them. Couple that with a lack of a confirmed dev statement confirming its canon, multiple characters in Payday like Jacket that should be dead at the time of their series, which prevents them realistically from existing together, and Tony having 0 scaling chain towards his imposter makes him scaling to that game Inapplicable.
Artwork
(Advent_Chao)
(Merlin the Strange)
Verdict
(From both Torchwick and Advent)
Under the scorching heat of the Florida sun, these two have shown time and time again to have the power, the will, and the balls to rise among the ranks and have the world all down south on their feet. So in a fight between them, it only feels right to split it in the same way they managed their empires.
Muscle & Legwork
Starting off with the basics, both Tony and Tommy have displayed relatively grounded shows of strength. Tony was able to cut off Jiminiez’s hand with a pocket knife and strangle Boots Eddie with a colostomy bag just after a coma, while Tommy has been able to make some dents in cars and beat someone to death with 3 hits. These feats aren’t anything out of the ordinary, and if it came down to who’s stronger, it’d be neck and neck.
Speaking of, speed’s surprisingly close as well. Going off their main feats first, both of them have been able to maneuver themselves around shootouts and get off scot-free, but Tony takes it a step further by straight-up shooting RPG rockets out of the air and ducking under shotgun fire, both giving him a reaction speed of 39.076-128.205 m/s and 101.42 m/s, respectively. And this is not including Sosa’s men being able to duck under his Uzi fire, which would bump that number up to 236.569 m/s. However, given Tommy’s scaling to Mike dodging pistol fire and SMG bullets, both 164.013 m/s and 232.834 m/s, respectively, he’d be more than able to keep up with Tony’s reaction speed. While there is a very small percentage between Tony and Tommy’s best feats, it’s so negligible that it might as well be equal.
Durability-wise, both have largely survived similar things. In the more specific range, Tony’s been able to survive grenade explosions and the shockwave from an RPG one, while Tommy could survive those 4 car explosions at the same time, which would tally up to 0.012 Tons of TNT, granted this is with him having his health and armor in full capacity. But outside of that, he can still scale to Phil’s feat of tanking an explosion, which would still give him a number of 0.0035 Tons of TNT. However, all of this would only really apply to their blunt durability; they’d still be vulnerable to each other’s piercing firepower, and a well-placed shot could kill any of them regardless.
So, tallying the numbers up, both of these criminal masterminds show very similar displays of physical prowess, making it a tie in Muscle & Legwork.
Heaters
Time for guns and glory for this one, and you may expect Tommy to take an obvious edge here, right? He IS a GTA character, and if there’s one thing they are well known for, it's a frankly broken amount of weaponry. Surprisingly, however, Tony can match Tommy when it comes to their Arsenal.
For starters, they basically have the same weapons when it comes to the more basic stuff, like rifles, shotguns, pistols, etc. Both even have the same melee weapons with blunt weapons, bladed ones and even chainsaws. Even their explosive weapons, both have pretty equivalent ones with stuff like Tony’s missile launcher and Tommy’s RPGs. Tommy technically has more on hand explosive weapons with grenades and remote explosives, but Tony’s mounted grenade launchers make up for that as well.
Both also have equivalent ways to spray dozens of bullets onto each other with Tony’s SAW and Tommy’s minigun. The only weapons they don’t share equivalents are Tony’s combination weapons allowing a more immediate way to use explosives and Tommy’s flamethrower and tear gas, which we'll cover the latter later.
Even their vehicles are all matched pretty well, although the only one that’ll be relevant is Tony’s turret car, which, while useful, can easily be blown up with Tommy’s many explosives. Outside of a few options, neither Tony nor Tommy have a huge advantage in terms of Heaters.
Masterminds
Now, if you’re gonna be a kingpin, you need to have a great mind and experience to run an empire, both as a leader and as a brawler.
Tony easily has an edge in skill, not only has he been in the criminal world for a slightly longer time than Tommy (starting at 14 against 15, as they’re both around their 40s), but Montana has been an active player for far longer than Vercetti, spending his entire life going from one criminal operation to another, be it joining gangs, managing his own web of distribution and even spending some years in Europe without any knowledge of the country or its language but managing to thrive through it nonetheless. Tommy is talented, sure, but his range of experience is lacking compared to his opponent's, especially since he spent 15 years in prison while Tony spent that same time further polishing his strategies and knowledge. And this isn’t even going Tony’s time in the Cuban Military, that sure wasn’t as extensive as his later endeavors, but still ensures that the cuban can easily outskill his italian foe if it came down to raw combat talent. Especially in fisticuffs, where Tommy just wouldn’t have much of a chance to fight back against Tony’s experience and creativity. If it all came down to who’s more skilled, there’s no doubt about it, Tony will easily overwhelm Tommy.
On the other hand, however, Tommy easily has an edge in mentality. Despite all these great feats and displays of cleverness, Tony’s perpetual achilles’ heel has been his impatience and ego, he cannot keep his head cool if he’s on the backfoot, making him open to a variety of critical shots regardless of how skilled he is, and that’s a sentiment that Tommy will 100% take to his advantage. By comparison, Tommy has always kept his head cool when facing overwhelming odds, even when the situation is critical, like how when he had to drive the Love Fist car with a bomb planted on it at top speed for several minutes while the band yelled directly at his ear, or the numerous ambushes he’s faced by the police, CIA or even the French Secret Service.
Let us put it this way, when Tony was faced with a perceived betrayal by one of his closest allies and a subsequent raid from all fronts by his worst enemy in the worst moment in his life, Montana lost his shit and, at best he had to run away to recover, while at worst straight up died. When Tommy was in that exact same situation, not only did he keep himself levelheaded, but stood his ground and killed absolutely everyone in his way. And since they are pushing themselves to their limits so equally, Tony’s gonna lose more and more of his shit as the fight goes on while Tommy will always be on top of it.
Overall, Tony and Tommy have their strengths and weaknesses when it comes to their approaches in combat. LIke we said earlier, by these metrics, Tony’s a better brawler, but Tommy’s a better leader. So, yet again, we can’t really say one has a significant advantage over the other in this case.
Da Big Ones
Whew, no real big advantages on one side or another so far. But that’s gonna change real soon, now that we have probably the most important part of the debate: Da Big Ones, their abilities, and special power-ups they can gather to be even tougher to deal with. Off the bat, not all abilities, like say, Tommy’s no-fall damage one, are gonna be useful in a fight like this, but there’s still plenty of other ones both would have to consider.
For starters, both have different advantages in regards to their stamina. Tony’s a very difficult bastard to take down with guns alone, as he’s been tortured, stabbed, and shot several times in the chest and still was able to fight. While guns are still lethal to Tony, his sheer resilience means he'd have to deal a lot less damage to put Tommy down than vice versa. Tommy’s stamina edge, however, is in his infinite running. Tommy can run nonstop with no limits, while Tony can tire out after a few seconds at a time. Despite their relative speed, Tommy can certainly run long enough to get to better positions in the fight, which will be relevant later.
Vercetti also had the edge in ammunition, having access to infinite ammo permanently and passively, while Tony has to get a power-up to get such a luxury, and it’s on a time limit as well. Should the fight last long enough, this would certainly be a problem for Tony, and he has suffered ammo issues before, like in the movie.
But obviously, as great as these advantages are, they won’t hold a candle to the one major thing: Rage Mode VS Adrenaline. Both of these abilities are so potent that they could very easily give the other the win if done right. Let’s cover each.
Tony’s Rage Mode, to be blunt, is absurd. The ability to turn himself invincible for 5-10 seconds is really powerful, coupled with infinite ammunition to spam down on a target. Tony’s ability to walk through a lot of Tommy’s weaponry does seem pretty bad for the Vice City kingpin, right? How does Tommy get past this?
Well, surprisingly, there’s definitely a few options to outlast the rage mode. For starters, Tommy’s tear gas would provide a great way to take down Tony while it’s active. The Rage Mode may allow Tony to tough out impact and piercing weapons, but gas attacks are something he’s never been able to deal with, and would still kill him in a couple of seconds. The slight drawback to this is tear gas can also kill Tommy if he deploys it wrong, but given Tommy’s cooler head it’s reasonable to say he can safely pull it off.
Second counter to Rage Mode? Simply, take cover. The fight’s not going to take place in a white void, after all; there’s going to be cover for both to hide and shoot at each other. Now, this isn’t the most solid counter, as Tony can simply rush Tommy behind cover, but it would waste his time, and time in Rage Mode is brief. Still, these 2 solutions aren’t perfect and Tony can still kill him, so what’s the problem with Rage Mode clutching the win for the Scarface?
Well, then we have to cover Tommy’s Adrenaline Pills, which… okay to be blunt, Tommy’s pills are the best answer to not just Rage Mode, but to this entire fight. When this powerup goes up, Tommy’s strength and reflexes are amped so much, everything becomes slow motion to Tommy, including gunfire. This allows him to not only kill people in a single blow with his physical abilities, but also avoid any gunshots while firing his own. The effects also last for quite a long time, lasting for 1-20 minutes, depending on if you use the real world time or the in-game time.
Does Tony have a counter towards this ability? No, actually. Once the pills are activated, Tony is a complete sitting duck, as he would be moving so much slower by comparison. This would easily allow Tommy to outlast Rage Mode, as no matter what timeframe you use, 10 seconds is MUCH lower than a full minute. Tommy would be able to avoid anything Tony’s Rage Mode can dish out before he fizzles out, before shooting Tony in the head first. With his infinite stamina for running, that makes things even easier for Tommy to pull off. Even if he does get shot, Tommy’s armor would still be a decent failsafe and would allow him to land that shot first.
Simply put, while both abilities are frankly, ludicrous under a versus perspective, only Tony’s Rage Mode has counterplay to work around once the ability is active. Tommy’s Adrenaline, on the other hand, has no counterplay while also countering Tony’s rage. Coupling that with Tommy’s running stamina and true infinite ammunition, Tommy has everything he needed to take Tony out, and while Tony can definitely score wins under Rage Mode, he simply didn’t have a guarantee with this ability long enough between his vulnerabilities and shorter time period. All in all, Tommy Vercetti takes this final category.
Conclusion
"The World Is Yours, Chico, and everything in it. So say goodnight to the bad guy!"
Advantages:
Much more experienced.
Much more aggressive.
Weapon Combos offer Tony options that Tommy doesn’t have.
Better pain tolerance, all things considered.
Rage Mode can easily secure a win…
Will win a close-quarters battle.
Al Pacino’s Performance.
Equal:
Both are dead even in strength and speed.
Both have ways to heal wounds.
Both have access to Unlimited Ammo, however…
Both will die from a well-placed gunshot.
Disadvantages:
Far more egotistical.
More prone to leaving himself open to attacks.
… but Tommy can wait it out with Adrenaline Pills.
Rage Mode in general has more counterplay than Adrenaline
Vulnerable to Tear Gas regardless of Rage Mode if it lands properly.
… Tony’s temporary, either with Rage Mode or its respective power-up.
Far less likely to win a war of attrition with limited ammo and patience
Slightly fewer weapons to work with.
Canonically died due to backshots.
Advantages:
Much more levelheaded as a fighter.
Physically more durable to blunt attacks
Adrenaline Pills serve as a perfect countermeasure to Rage Mode.
Adrenaline Pills also let him survive a 1v1 fistfight.
Tear Gas would be pretty effective if it lands properly…
Slightly more weapons to utilize.
His Unlimited Ammo is permanent and doesn’t need anything to function.
Fought against a wider variety of opponents.
Better stamina for running and drawing out fights.
Ray Lioeta’s Performance (may he rest in peace).
Equal:
Both are dead even in strength and speed.
Both have ways to heal wounds.
Both will die from a solid gunshot.
Disadvantages:
Rage can still kill him if caught off guard.
… But if it doesn’t, it might kill him as well.
Less experienced.
Will lose up close without Adrenaline Pills
The “Definitive” Edition (“hey I think it’s fine, better than dealing with PS2 controls”-Torchwick)
It’s a bit of cliche to say this, but this genuinely was an insanely close fight– possibly the closest in this series of blogs. Tony and Tommy are neck and neck in a lot of different ways. Their stats are equal, and their Arsenal matched up so close to each other, meaning that their abilities and mindsets are the ones that can tip the scales.
Make no mistake, Tony is a complete monster on the field, and running the fight 100 times, he can absolutely score a few victories. His endurance and experience are mind boggling. However, Tommy just had more guarantees with his ways to win. His levelheadedness would leave him less open to attacks, whereas Tony’s ego and madness has consistently left himself vulnerable just to taunt his enemies. Under a war of attrition, that’s a big deal, as well as Tommy having true infinite ammunition than Tony who only has it for a short time.
Even with the absurdity of Rage Mode, Tommy still has answers to this, from staying behind cover, tossing tear gas which will kill him immediately if it lands, or popping adrenaline pills, which guarantees a win for Vice City’s crime lord. Meanwhile, Tony has no answers to Tommy’s big abilities, which is the deciding factor of our verdict. The fact that Tony has no workarounds towards Adrenaline, while Tommy has workarounds towards Rage meant that he simply could not land a consistent enough chance to take the win over his opponent.
In the end of this tale, Tommy’s Self Control and superior abilities would Push the Scarface to His Final Limit. How ironic, Tony Montana fell victim to Vice once again.
The winner is… Tommy Vercetti.
Final Tally
Tony Montana (1) - Scumbag Steve
Tommy Vercetti (3) - Toppat Torchwick, Advent_Chao, Merlin The Stranger
Afterword
Holy shit, this was… a lot. Hey y’all, this is Toppat Torchwick. You saw me in a couple of Cape projects already, but this was the first one I took full control of, and it was an interesting learning experience for me. Thank you, Cape, for letting me even do this, and thanks to everyone who helped see this to the end. April, outside of my birthday, was admittedly a depressing month for me, but this helped distract it for me.
But yeah, Tony Montana VS Tommy Vercetti. This was a blog I wanted to do for the longest time, and I’m pretty glad how things went! Sure, it took longer than usual and I had to deal with a lot of people leaving the project, but I'm still glad it’s out. I hope this blog helps with shilling this idea! It’s so cool, and I think we need more grounded fights in the community.
It’s a preeeety simple match thematically. Both are gangsters in the ol’ sunshine state that started with nothing and have to build their own empires in the state. You can also make the connection that both lost power (tony at the beginning of Scarface: The World Is Yours and the beginning of Vice City for Tommy) and eventually gained it back, and became so powerful they managed to whack their old bosses and make the whole industry theirs. There’s also stuff with Lopez and Lance as well but that’s not as needed.
Aesthetically… yeah it’s perfect, with the whole 80’s aesthetic both have as well as the Miami lifestyle. This also goes for the soundtrack-imagine a cross between Push It To The Limit and Self Control-their most iconic tracks. Break The Rules From Payday 2 is actually a really good example of how the track can work, and outside of Los Santos Crew vs Payday Gang, this has the best soundtrack potential for any GTA matchup.
Banter wise it’s also REALLY fun, with how much these guys shit talk, but while Tony’s way more wild and hotheaded, Tommy’s more levelheaded and sarcastic, which can make for hilarious dialogue while also giving them some badass lines. Something like
“Think you can bust my balls with some shit? I’m Tony Montana, what are you, fucker!?”
“Just someone pissing on you before I kill you.”
“If this is the best my only competition down south is, this is gonna be easy.”
“Yea ya, keep talking your mouth, because you’ll be cut like a fuckin chicken.”
And fight wise, yea it’s your wild gunfight. Tony surprisingly has a lot of weapons from the games that match really well with Tommy. Definitely can have the fight start in one of their mansions or in a street battle as both are competitors in the cocaine business. Could have Tommy try tricking Tony with fake money but Tony rejecting it and causing a giant gang fight with their support and themselves. As the fight goes on, you can REALLY highlight their personalities, where Tony gets more frustrated by resistance by an actual challenger to his business, while Tommy’s more collected despite being a bit more frustrated, just doesn’t have that impact on him more.
Of course, you gotta have the climax be Tony’s Rage Mode putting Tommy at the back foot, before he pops Adrenaline Pills and slides just enough to avoid the rain fire Tony can dish out, which can really showcase how potent both powerups are, but Tony’s runs out quicker before Tommy pulls the trigger. Tommy winning in general, feels right to me, as Tony found someone exactly like him, but followed the advice he got from Frank more. There’s always a bigger fish.
I’ll write another shill for this later, but hope you enjoy this project! If it goes well and I have time, I MAY be able to do another project, potentially a Mouse P.I For Hire one, as that’s my recent hyperfixation that didn’t get a blog. See you soon!
Until then…
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